Ave, Medicus. Morituri Te Salutant.

[sariagray]

Saluting is an interesting action. 

Let me explain.

 

A month or so ago, I finally got around to watching the "Ten" specials ("The Next Doctor," "Planet of the Dead," "The Waters of Mars," and "The End of Time") and my father stumbled into the living room in the midst of "Planet of the Dead."

Captain Erisa Magambo of UNIT had just saluted the Doctor and my father pointed out something interesting (and quite probably untrue, from what I've read). 

A former US Military man (Air Force, during 'Nam), he felt obliged to tell me that the British open-palm salute is indicative of either having lost or forfeited a war. Americans salute palm-down because we have no lost (or forfeited, I'm still unclear) a war, but it's on a slight tilt because it's iffy (I think this last part is a joke). Considering that, let's do a brief review, in pictures.

Wilf salutes here, open-palmed. This is a logical thing, so I assume. He is a military man and Knows His Stuff.



More Wilf, more open-palmed saluting. And a Union Jack in the background, to boot.



Captain Erisa Magambo of UNIT also salutes with an open palm, fingers at the temple. This picture...amuses me greatly. The look on her face makes me giggle, but that's neither here nor there.



The best is when Rory salutes Americans with an open-palm and says "America salutes you." It wasn't just the British accent that was hilarious, but if what my father says is true, he is totally using the British salute. I literally laughed so hard I couldn't breathe when I saw this. Thanks, Dad. You're the reason my keyboard is now slightly sticky with spit-out coffee.

 

Ahh. But! Here is where it gets interesting.
 

   

 

What is up with Jack!? Is this...his attempt at being fake-American? Is this a Boeshanian salute? Does ANY other person (who is not distinctly from another country) salute like this in the Whoniverse? I feel like this is somehow important to Jack's character. And, even if the common belief about saluting in Great Britain versus America is untrue, it IS apparently the common belief and therefore it could be an intentional thing on the part of the actors/creators. 

 

What does everyone else think? I'm curious.

 

Comments

[sariagray.livejournal.com]

Your logical reason makes complete sense, but I feel like...if the director(s), producer(s), writer(s), whoever had a say, they would've corrected it?

I like your other reasons, too. I would be interested to see John Hart's salute, though I think it would involve a rude hand gesture and thus would not be a reliable source of information.

Your last reason, though? LOLZ FOREVAH! Yes, yes exactly!

[eldarwannabe.livejournal.com]

As much as we fans will obsess over the smallest detail, I honestly don't think the director/etc. even though about it while they were filming. John Barrowman saluted and looked good, that was a wrap. (I could be wrong, it could be deliberate. I just suspect it isn't.)

I would like to see Hart's salute now. Both versions. :D

THE LAST REASON IS MY FAV. ♥

[sariagray.livejournal.com]

Well, while I will agree that Jack's salute is not a definite intentional thing, Rory's was. And as I currently am in love with Rory...yep. I am okay with this. ;) ♥

But, in general, I do try to take note of the little things...I don't know that it's so much obsession as it is analyzing art? Not necessarily great art, mind, but any art form. And this, of course, my be a hold over from my course in Visual Images and Literature, but I digress.

I definitely think we need some Hart saluting. All of the kinds of salutes ever. A montage of salutes, if you will. ;)

[eldarwannabe.livejournal.com]

Oh, man, Rory's was definitely intentional. I was rolling with laughter on the floor, and my roommate at the time had no idea why.

Taking note of the little things is what drives fandom a lot of the time, I think. Writing fic based on expressions during scenes, trying to make all the fiddly bits fit together in a way that makes sense...it's the best part. I noticed the salute thing, but not enough to double-check all the instances until you put this post up, and now I'm all pondery about it. A course in Visual Images and Lit. sounds really cool (And as a media studies student - TV is art! Painting is media! Tear down the artificial barriers that separate them! /may have wanted to take an English class for my major and was turned down)

Salutes everywhere! As far as the eye can see! \o/

[sariagray.livejournal.com]

Can I just say that I Officially adore you?! See this nice paper? It's even got a stamp. ;)

I totally agree - without the little things, we'd have very little to write about!

To that point, I think that my propensity to believe these minuscule nods to those who pay attention/have prior knowledge/have fathers who interrupt their Important TV Watching stems from my own inclusion of the same sort of tiny references in my own writing. Wishful thinking, perhaps, but I love to pick things apart. :)

And I totally concur with your call-to-arms re: art, media, and the things of which it is comprised. All art is media; all media is art. This is often forgotten, I think.

Turned down!? Boo to that. :( The class was amazing, and, though it was technically an optional high school course, it was one of those that sort of stays with your forever. The instructor was brilliant, and I learned more there than I have in the majority of all of my "higher level" courses. Mostly because it taught me to open my eyes, to see the smaller details that make up the bigger picture. I can't watch any visual media without over-analyzing now. :-/ Which is good, until you start wanting to point out everything! (Case in point....)

This may lead to saluting!fic, somewhere down the line. I don't know how, where, when, or why, but I have a sneaking suspicion....;)

[eldarwannabe.livejournal.com]

Aw, thanks! I think you're definitely AWESOME. Your fics are always gorgeous.

I love to think that the little things are nods to the eagle-eyed, and sometimes they are! And...lots of times they aren't. The more you learn about real film sets, the more your realize that while some things are planned, and some things are thrown in by the actors, and some things are director brilliance, lots of things are just mistakes or happenstance that we latch onto. Sometimes it's things they threw on without really thinking about it, or just didn't consider long enough. Won't stop us, though! ;)

(Writing, I think, is much better about this. It might be the result of only one author (and a bunch of editors) but they typically seem more in tune with the little things.)

Ha, I really got on that soapbox, didn't I? I'm glad you agree. Some of the methods applied to one art form/medium/etc. can so often be used for other ones, but just aren't, due to value judgements. :( That class just sounds better and better though. And I love pointing out/hearing about the over-analyzing miniscule stuff. Sometimes I wish people would cross-post and save meta the same way they do fic. It's all so interesting.

And I fully encourage saluting!fic! I'd read it! :D

[sariagray.livejournal.com]

*Blush* Thank you!

Sometimes it's things they threw on without really thinking about it, or just didn't consider long enough.

I definitely agree with this. I mean, even in my own writing, I do things occasionally that I didn't even realize I did? Part of the problem is that we, as a society, absorb so much information that any allusions we make may be unintentional. Writing is more focused in that regard, though, as there are less cooks to spoil the soup. ;) Generally, anyway.

Cross-posting meta has been done, and I am all for it! I just wouldn't cross-post my own, as it's not all that well thought-out. It's more along the lines of "AH! A thing I thought of! Have some slapdash photos from Google and some vague words!" I've read some pretty amazing metas, though, that verge on the level of dissertation. And then I've read some Legit Essays that are crap.

Maybe I'll do a meta on the color symbolism of Ianto's ties in each episode for my next lackadaisical meta...*Considers* ;)

Good to know I'd have an audience for saluting!fic! Now to...think of a premise. Ugh. Premises. I hate them.

[eldarwannabe.livejournal.com]

Yes to unintentional references. Of course, there's alwasy the problem when people don't reference something, but everyone reading/seeing it assumes they did. (Any time the number "42" is used, for examples, is an assumed reference, regardless of intent.)

Not well though out meta is sometimes the best! Because then everyone can puzzle over it together. Daunting essays are also great, but are incredibly intimidating when your own thoughts aren't as well-organized.

I WANT META ON THE TIES. COLORS ARE IMPORTANT!

Oh, man! Now I really want to put together a meta/etc. community, like a Torchwood fanfiction community for fandom discussion and cross-posted meta and questions and stuff. The only one I've ever seen was for Star Trek, and it wasn't very successful, but I love this stuff in Torchwood! *agonizes*

Eh, premises. Our fandom is 98% smut! You don't need a premise! :D :D :D